Tom Gores reaches deal to buy Pistons (or did he ?)

[SportsFromA2]

God I hate this argument.


So far, all but maybe 3 or 4 of this years draft picks have been flops. The year prior... Maybe all but 6... Yet, Joe alone sucks at the NBA draft. Not the other 32 teams who've had the same (if not less) success.

Everyone wants to hold him to a standard that no one else has achieved and using a standard of success that doesn't even exist. Compare Dumars to his peers as far as the draft goes, and he's probably in the top 25% if you measure him by the number picks he has that have had some success in the NBA.

My thing is this- I don't give a damn what some player does with another team.. How many of Joe's draft picks have helped HIS team? Stuck's the best I guess, and he's a bottom 15 starting point guard in the NBA..

I actually like the Daye pick, but dammit there isn't enough time to see what he can do because the team has 65468412 SG/SF's on the team.. Which again, is Joe's fault.

No doubt in my mind if Rip, Tay, and Charlie V were not on this team those draft picks would be more successful and I would actually like those picks.. But they (Rip, Tay, CV) are on the team and just doesn't make sense to draft players knowing you're never going to be able to find the minutes to play them

[MoOff24]

lockstep with joeking on this..

[joeking1978]

Mything is this- I don't give a damn what some player does with another team.. How many of Joe's draft picks have helped HIS team? Stuck's a bottom 15 starting point guard in the NBA..

I actually like the Daye pick, but dammit there isn't enough time to see what he can do because the team has 65468412 SG/SF's on the team.. Which again, is Joe's fault.

No doubt in my mind if Rip, Tay, and Charlie V were not on this team those draft picks would be more successful and I would actually like those picks.. But they are and just doesn't make sense to draft players knowing you're never going to be able to find the minutes to play them

Bro... There are what, 10 roster spots on each team with maybe an extra practice player or two? With the salary cap and limited space... And the WIN NOW mentality... No one and no team has the luxury of keeping everyone they draft. You draft 2-3 players each year. That's 20% of your roster. That means two vets have to go or if the rooks don't shine right away... They themselves are let go. With the crapshoot of the NBA draft... GM's are often hamstrung by the rookie contracts they are forced to levie on pure chance in fear that you may accidentally pass on the next Jordan. This forces them to let a serviceable veteran go as they have to play the higher contracts rather than the better players sometimes.

Comparatively, in the NFL... A team will get 6-8 players. Their roster us 60. You have a lot more wiggle room plus more time to allow kids to develop. No NBA gm has this luxury. Ultimately, I think Joe D is in a good spot. He'll have a couple of these contracts fall soon all awhile allowing some vets to play out their time as a few young bucks develop at a good pace without forcing them into the mix too soon. Face it... THIS IS DETROIT! No superstar will come here... This team will always have to be a blue collar, hard working team. Salary caps not gonna matter as much in Detroit... Not unless you want to over pay someone who doesn't want to play here... Which he already tried...

Maybe Chris Brown can do his next right up on the NBA draft and show side by side comparisons of GM's an their respective draft picks. For both those they kept and those who had to move on but still found success.

[SportsFromA2]

Bro... There are what, 10 roster spots on each team with maybe an extra practice player or two? With the salary cap and limited space... And the WIN NOW mentality... No one and no team has the luxury of keeping everyone they draft. You draft 2-3 players each year. That's 20% of your roster. That means two vets have to go or if the rooks don't shine right away... They themselves are let go. With the crapshoot of the NBA draft... GM's are often hamstrung by the rookie contracts they are forced to levie on pure chance in fear that you may accidentally pass on the next Jordan. This forces them to let a serviceable veteran go as they have to play the higher contracts rather than the better players sometimes.

Comparatively, in the NFL... A team will get 6-8 players. Their roster us 60. You have a lot more wiggle room plus more time to allow kids to develop. No NBA gm has this luxury.

Maybe Chris Brown can do his next right up on the NBA draft and show side by side comparisons of GM's an their respective draft picks. For both those they kept and those who had to move on but still found success.

but Bro.. it's not just the draft failures..

Joe Dumars ruined this franchise in 2009.

BillyD died in March 2009. A couple of months later, Iverson's contract expired and the pistons had ~25million or so in cap space.

If Karen Davidson or whatever "ownership uncertainty" was somehow hamstringing joe or tightening the budget any, He wouldn't have been able to sign both Ben and Charlie V! Dumars used up all the cap space.

While I don't like how Karen Davidson handled this, I wish it was quicker and less public, the financial constraints are there because Joe used up all the cap space on two players who not only haven't lived up to their billing, but their presence has helped alter/ruin whatever team chemistry was there so the addition of them actually could have HURT the team..

And that all is totally on Joe.. Can't see how you can blame ownership

[ChrisBrown]

Maybe Chris Brown can do his next right up on the NBA draft and show side by side comparisons of GM's an their respective draft picks. For both those they kept and those who had to move on but still found success.

Kinda tired from recruiting nonsense right now, but maybe I'll give it a shot in couple of days. I actually tried something like this a few years back, but I think I was just comparing Detroit's picks in the Dumars era to San Antonio's pick during the same time frame.

The biggest problem for me, I guess, is how we identify a successful draft pick. I'm absolutely convinced that 95% of the guys in the NBA can put up big numbers if they get the playing time, but it's hard to tell who can be productive on good teams. You know...were Tyreke Evans and Brandon Jennings good draft picks, or are they just putting up numbers because they're on Sacramento and Milwaukee?

And just for fun, Afflalo just finished off a 19-point 4th quarter by hitting a game-winner at the buzzer. Good thing they gave him up for nothing.

[joeking1978]

but Bro.. it's not just the draft failures..

Joe Dumars ruined this franchise in 2009.

BillyD died in March 2009. A couple of months later, Iverson's contract expired and the pistons had ~25million or so in cap space.

If Karen Davidson or whatever "ownership uncertainty" was somehow hamstringing joe or tightening the budget any, He wouldn't have been able to sign both Ben and Charlie V! Dumars used up all the cap space.

While I don't like how Karen Davidson handled this, I wish it was quicker and less public, the financial constraints are there because Joe used up all the cap space on two players who not only haven't lived up to their billing, but their presence has helped alter/ruin whatever team chemistry was there so the addition of them actually could have HURT the team..

And that all is totally on Joe.. Can't see how you can blame ownership

When did I blame ownership?

I'm simply saying that running Dumars out of office is hasty and those that are calling for his head are holding him to unfair standards that unfortunately Dumars himself set when he spoiled this fanbase. He is still one of the better GM's in this league...

Otherwise, we may just end up like we did after swapping out Flip for Curry and Keuster again (relating that to the GM position in another be wary what you wish for moment)

[mtdman]

IMO Joe has to go. He built the 2004 team in his image to play the kind of bball he used to play. Tough, defensive ball. The league has done everything it can to get rid of that style of play. And Joe has not shown he can adapt to the direction of the league. He was great to begin his tenure and created a team that was very relevant for many years, despite the league's rejection of those teams. But no gm lasts forever and imo it's time for new blood. Joe should step down at the end of the year and save the new dude from firing him.

[Preacher_Boy]

Like I said before, guys like Gores aren't the type to just do ok. He will spend more than Mr. D ever did once things gets straightened out. I think this is a good thing from that standpoint. That said, I don't know of any basketball connection he has, so he's basically like Cuban in that regard. He's a egomaniac rich guy that bought a team. We will see.

Do you know Gores or is this speaking from perception?

[FastFreddie]

Why I like this Gores: I hope he is aggressive and infuses the franchise with cash, direction, motivation, etc.


Why I do not: Before Mr. D's death, the Pistons were one of the great organizations in the NBA, top to bottom. I just hope that Gores can continue that tradition.

2. I also don't like the idea that Gores will likely keep the Pistons in Auburn Hills. I was hoping that Ilitch would bring them downtown, where they belong. But we never know, maybe Gores has a long term plan to bring them back.

[Fraze]

Goin' to Work!

[General283]

Although it will it never happen, it makes a ton of sense for the Wings to be relocated to the Palace, while the Pistons get a new place in Detroit.

Edit: However that would kill the downriver folk I guess...